In this episode, host Corey Nathan shares a candid reflection about a recent encounter where he was right on the facts and the law—but completely wrong in how he presented them. Yet if we're honest with ourselves about when we make mistakes, it's a good opportunity to learn, reminding us that how we communicate is just as important as what we communicate.
What You’ll Learn:
Why being right on the law isn’t enough in a conversation
How righteous anger can derail productive dialogue
Why due process matters for everyone—especially those who aren't guilty of crimes
Tools for engaging in hard conversations with empathy and curiosity
How the Constitution and Judeo-Christian values intersect in public discourse
Episode Highlights:
[00:02:00] Corey introduces the story and the key lesson he learned
[00:05:00] Breakdown of the Alien Enemies Act and a real legal case
[00:06:45] A stranger challenges Corey at a restaurant
[00:07:30] Corey "goes Jersey" and loses his cool
[00:13:00] What due process really protects and why it matters
[00:16:00] How Isaac Saul, David Brooks, and Mónica Guzmán inspired a better way to respond
[00:18:00] Reading the First and Fifth Amendments to ground the conversation
Featured Quotes:
"I was completely right on the facts, but I was completely wrong on the delivery." — Corey Nathan
"Due process is there for the innocent just as much as the guilty—even more so for the innocent." — Corey Nathan
"Ask at least three questions before making your point." — inspired by Isaac Saul
📣 Call to Action:
If you found this conversation insightful, please:✅ Subscribe to Talkin' Politics & Religion Without Killin' Each Other on your favorite podcast platform.✅ Leave a review on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you listen: ratethispodcast.com/goodfaithpolitics✅ Support the show on Patreon: patreon.com/politicsandreligion✅ Watch the full conversation and subscribe on YouTube: youtube.com/@politicsandreligion
🔗 Connect With Us on Social Media
@coreysnathan:
Bluesky
LinkedIn
Instagram
Threads
Facebook
Substack
Our Sponsors:
Meza Wealth Management: www.mezawealth.com
Prolux Autogroup: www.proluxautogroup.com or www.granadahillsairporttransportation.com
Let’s keep talking politics and religion—with gentleness and respect. 🎙️💡

In this episode, we sit down with Isaac Saul, founder of Tangle, a widely respected, nonpartisan political newsletter. Isaac and his team bring a fresh approach to political journalism by curating multiple perspectives—right, left, and independent—on major stories of the day. Corey, a fan and avid reader of Tangle, dives deep into Isaac’s upbringing in Bucks County, PA, how that shaped his civic “multilingualism,” and the genesis of Tangle during a particularly difficult phase of his career. Together, they explore the challenges of journalistic ethics, political polarization, media bias, and the future of trustworthy news.
What We Discuss:
Why Bucks County, PA, is so friggin' awesome! And why it plays a crucial role in shaping moderate political thinkers.
How Isaac Saul built Tangle from the ground up as a response to media frustration.
The journalistic principles and ethical guardrails that guide Isaac’s work.
How to discern quality journalism in an era dominated by clickbait and misinformation.
The dangers of polarization and what gives Isaac hope about our democratic future.
Episode Highlights:
[00:01:00] Isaac Saul shares the mission behind Tangle and what inspired him to create it.
[00:05:00] Corey and Isaac explore how growing up in politically diverse Bucks County cultivated empathy and civic fluency.
[00:10:00] Isaac discusses his unique way of reaching conspiracy-minded friends—by “using their language” and exposing financial incentives in media.
[00:15:00] Isaac describes his journalistic background and the importance of reporting with integrity and skepticism.
[00:24:00] Isaac recounts his “f*** this” moment that led to launching Tangle after being rejected from multiple major outlets.
[00:34:00] Corey explains his methodical approach to reading Tangle and how it helps refine his own viewpoints.
[00:40:00] Behind the scenes: How Isaac and his team choose stories and fairly represent both sides of complex political issues.
[00:54:00] Isaac shares his hopes and fears about political division, executive overreach, and the role of media in democracy.
Featured Quotes:
"The people who are really politically engaged on the right and the left right now are living in just different realities." – Isaac Saul
"I know what I think. It’s the least interesting thing on the planet. I live with this brain all day. I want to hear what others think." – Isaac Saul
"You should treat every click like you're handing a news outlet a dollar." – Isaac Saul
"Centrism is an ideology in and of itself. I’m not trying to land in the middle—I’m just being honest about my real reactions." – Isaac Saul
Resources Mentioned:
Tangle Newsletter – www.readtangle.com
Isaac Saul’s TED Talk: “What Media Doesn’t Tell You” – youtu.be/543mYKKh1EE?si=CjdQv94HzT04vknh
How Media Bias Works (Tangle article) – www.readtangle.com/why-the-media-is-broken/
Isaac on Twitter: x.com/Ike_Saul
📣 Call to Action:
If you found this conversation insightful, please:✅ Subscribe to Talkin' Politics & Religion Without Killin' Each Other on your favorite podcast platform.✅ Leave a review on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you listen: ratethispodcast.com/goodfaithpolitics✅ Support the show on Patreon: patreon.com/politicsandreligion✅ Watch the full conversation and subscribe on YouTube: youtube.com/@politicsandreligion
🔗 Connect With Us on Social Media
@coreysnathan:
Bluesky
LinkedIn
Instagram
Threads
Facebook
Substack
Our Sponsors:
Meza Wealth Management: www.mezawealth.com
Prolux Autogroup: www.proluxautogroup.com or www.granadahillsairporttransportation.com
Let’s keep talking politics and religion—with gentleness and respect. 🎙️💡

In this deeply moving episode, Corey Nathan welcomes Rabbi Sharon Brous, the senior and founding rabbi of IKAR, a groundbreaking Jewish community based in Los Angeles. Rabbi Brous is also the author of The Amen Effect: Ancient Wisdom to Heal Our Hearts and Mend Our Broken World. Together, they explore ancient traditions, mental health, spiritual leadership, and how to foster deeper, more compassionate human connections even across profound divides.
What We Discuss:
The ancient ritual of turning toward the brokenhearted and its modern relevance.
The profound impact of being seen and embraced in moments of vulnerability.
How leaders carry and process communal pain—and why that matters.
Practical wisdom on staying curious and compassionate across ideological divides.
The role of community design in spiritual experiences.
Episode Highlights:
[00:01:00] Rabbi Brous explains the Mishnah Middot and the ritual of turning toward the brokenhearted.
[00:08:00] Corey and Rabbi Brous discuss the concept of sin as a burden like mental illness.
[00:15:00] The transformative power of being truly seen and how crying makes space for new realities.
[00:20:00] Rabbi Brous reflects on the toll leadership can take and how caregivers must process pain.
[00:24:00] The design of IKAR’s prayer space and how it fosters visibility and community.
[00:34:00] Navigating discomfort with changes in religious leadership and traditions.
[00:42:00] How to stay at the table with those who hurt or anger us—and why it’s critical.
[00:53:00] A powerful story about transformation through simple presence and blessing.
Featured Quotes:
"Sometimes you don’t even want to get out of bed. Yet, sacred tradition compels us to show our brokenness—and trust that we will be held with love." — Rabbi Sharon Brous
"If you don’t metabolize pain, it will metastasize inside of you." — Rabbi Sharon Brous
"We can create new neural and spiritual pathways—by allowing ourselves to be seen and to receive love." — Rabbi Sharon Brous
"It takes courage to be curious about someone who hurt you, but that’s the only way to heal." — Rabbi Sharon Brous
Resources Mentioned:
The Amen Effect by Rabbi Sharon Brous: https://ikar.org/the-amen-effect/the-big-idea/
IKAR Jewish Community: https://www.ikar.org/
How to Know a Person by David Brooks: https://www.penguinrandomhouse.com/books/652822/how-to-know-a-person-by-david-brooks/
Fierce Love by Rev. Dr. Jacqui Lewis: https://jacquijlewis.com/fierce-love/
I Never Thought of It That Way by Mónica Guzmán: https://www.moniguzman.com/book
📣 Call to Action:
If you found this conversation insightful, please:✅ Subscribe to Talkin' Politics & Religion Without Killin' Each Other on your favorite podcast platform.✅ Leave a review on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you listen: ratethispodcast.com/goodfaithpolitics✅ Support the show on Patreon: patreon.com/politicsandreligion✅ Watch the full conversation and subscribe on YouTube: youtube.com/@politicsandreligion
🔗 Connect With Us on Social Media
@coreysnathan:
Bluesky
LinkedIn
Instagram
Threads
Facebook
Substack
Our Sponsors:
Meza Wealth Management: www.mezawealth.com
Prolux Autogroup: www.proluxautogroup.com or www.granadahillsairporttransportation.com
Let’s keep talking politics and religion—with gentleness and respect. 🎙️💡

In this heartfelt and wide-ranging episode, host Corey Nathan sits down with a very special guest — his own son, Emerson Riley Nathan. Together, they dive into Gen Z’s unique perspective on faith, politics, and culture. As a young adult navigating the complexities of belief, identity, and creativity, Emerson offers refreshing candor about his spiritual journey, social views, and passion for music. This conversation is an inspiring look at how different generations can engage in meaningful, respectful dialogue.
What You Will Learn:
Insights into Gen Z's evolving relationship with faith and spirituality
How Emerson balances skepticism and open-mindedness about religion
The impact of politics and social media on young people's worldview
How music and community-building are vital for mental health and connection
The dynamic of a father and son having open, vulnerable discussions about big life questions
Episode Highlights:
[00:01:00] – Emerson's "graveyard shift" lifestyle and its impact on his creativity
[00:03:00] – Emerson shares his journey growing up between Christianity and Judaism
[00:07:00] – How the 2012 election and political polarization shaped Emerson’s views
[00:11:00] – Moving away from organized religion and questioning traditional beliefs
[00:20:00] – Emerson's current agnostic beliefs and embracing uncertainty about the afterlife
[00:27:00] – The healing power of kindness and defining what it means to be good
[00:32:00] – Emerson’s passion for dubstep, rave culture, and community through music
[00:45:00] – Corey and Emerson discuss responsible adulthood, fatherhood, and finding purpose
[00:59:00] – How politics today have created both division and a sense of helplessness
Resources Mentioned:
Sugar Magnacious on Instagram
Debased Sound on Instagram
📣 Call to Action:
If you found this conversation insightful, please:✅ Subscribe to Talkin' Politics & Religion Without Killin' Each Other on your favorite podcast platform.✅ Leave a review on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you listen: ratethispodcast.com/goodfaithpolitics✅ Support the show on Patreon: patreon.com/politicsandreligion✅ Watch the full conversation and subscribe on YouTube: youtube.com/@politicsandreligion
🔗 Connect With Us on Social Media
@coreysnathan:
Bluesky
LinkedIn
Instagram
Threads
Facebook
Substack
Our Sponsors:
Meza Wealth Management: www.mezawealth.com
Prolux Autogroup: www.proluxautogroup.com or www.granadahillsairporttransportation.com
Let’s keep talking politics and religion—with gentleness and respect. 🎙️💡

In this episode, we welcome back political journalist and author Will Saletan. Will, formerly of Slate and now a writer for The Bulwark, is known for his sharp insights on American democracy, political corruption, and authoritarianism. Will reflects on the pivotal events leading up to and following the 2024 election, including Joe Biden’s withdrawal, Kamala Harris’s campaign, and Donald Trump's return to power. This thought-provoking conversation dives into the state of democracy, the rise of authoritarianism, and how ordinary Americans are responding.
What You Will Learn
How Will Saletan processed the chaotic political landscape leading up to the 2024 election.
Why many Americans seem indifferent to threats against constitutional rights.
Will’s analysis of Trump’s authoritarian tendencies and the implications for democracy.
The emerging role of European allies as America’s commitment to NATO and democracy weakens.
Practical strategies for handling misinformation and toxic discourse on social media.
Episode Highlights
[00:01:00] Introduction to Will Saletan and a reflection on major events since their last conversation.
[00:03:00] Will discusses his surprise at Biden’s physical and verbal deterioration during the 2024 campaign.
[00:07:00] The challenges Kamala Harris faced stepping into the race and why the "change election" dynamic mattered.
[00:11:00] Corey and Will examine why many Americans rationalized or minimized January 6th.
[00:23:00] Will explains how fear and profit motive lead companies and law firms to capitulate to authoritarian pressures.
[00:29:00] How self-censorship and fear of government retribution are stifling free speech.
[00:54:00] Will shares the "general idea" he’s concluded about the Trump administration: incompetence and stupidity at historic levels.
[01:03:00] Hope on the horizon: how European nations are stepping up to defend democratic values.
[01:06:00] Final reflections on the resilience of democracy beyond America’s current political struggles.
Featured Quotes
Will Saletan: "What clicks for me is very simple: they’re idiots. They're really stupid, and they think they're smart."
Will Saletan: "The danger isn’t just the lies themselves—it's the machinery of intimidation that stops people from even trying to tell the truth."
Corey Nathan: "It's encouraging when you realize people are so much more than the hat they might wear."
Will Saletan: "Even though America has faltered, there’s still goodness in the world—and it’s stepping up."
Resources Mentioned
Will Saletan at The Bulwark
Will's book: The Corruption of Lindsey Graham: A Case Study in The Rise of Authoritarianism
Will on Bluesky - @saletan.bsky.social
(Note: If Will referenced any other external resources or books you want linked specifically, just let me know!)
📣 Call to Action:
If you found this conversation insightful, please:✅ Subscribe to Talkin' Politics & Religion Without Killin' Each Other on your favorite podcast platform.✅ Leave a review on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you listen: ratethispodcast.com/goodfaithpolitics✅ Support the show on Patreon: patreon.com/politicsandreligion✅ Watch the full conversation and subscribe on YouTube: youtube.com/@politicsandreligion
🔗 Connect With Us on Social Media
@coreysnathan:
Bluesky
LinkedIn
Instagram
Threads
Facebook
Substack
Our Sponsors:
Meza Wealth Management: www.mezawealth.com
Prolux Autogroup: www.proluxautogroup.com or www.granadahillsairporttransportation.com
Let’s keep talking politics and religion—with gentleness and respect. 🎙️💡

In this solo episode, host Corey Nathan takes a deep dive into one of the foundational guidelines we've used in curating conversations both in person and online: handling misinformation. Corey reflects on his experiences moderating political and religious discussions, the evolution of social media moderation, and the fine balance between protecting free speech and maintaining civil discourse. We invite listeners into an honest exploration of free expression, civic engagement, and fostering better conversations, even with those we deeply disagree with.
What We Discuss:
Why it could be worth rethinking the rule to report and remove proven falsehoods from these forums.
The importance of understanding the First Amendment and time, place, and manner restrictions on free speech.
How maintaining civil discourse matters more than ever, even with the spread of misinformation.
Reflections on the lessons learned from controversial public conversations, like Gavin Newsom’s podcast guests and protests on college campuses.
How personal experiences during the pandemic and political unrest shaped Corey's approach to moderating tough conversations.
Episode Highlights:
[00:03:00] Corey’s initial set of rules for moderating conversations on social media.
[00:08:00] Why platforms like Meta and Twitter are no longer actively flagging misinformation.
[00:10:00] Revisiting the meaning of the First Amendment and its application to private forums.
[00:18:00] Discussing time, place, and manner restrictions in the context of campus protests and public demonstrations.
[00:23:00] Reflecting on the events of January 6th and the perpetuation of election fraud narratives.
[00:36:00] Learning from Gavin Newsom’s engagement with controversial figures like Steve Bannon and Charlie Kirk.
[00:43:00] Why civil engagement—even with those we strongly disagree with—might be more powerful than silencing falsehoods.
[00:52:00] Corey’s updated stance: allowing proven falsehoods to remain visible for educational and relational purposes.
Featured Quotes:
"Congress shall make no law... but that doesn’t mean I, a private individual, can’t curate conversations in my own forums."
"When we disagree is when it’s most important to protect free speech." 
"Sunlight is the best disinfectant. Let the worst ideas stand up to scrutiny." 
"Staying in relationship with those we disagree with gives us a better chance to understand and grow." 
Resources Mentioned:
The Foundation for Individual Rights and Expression (FIRE)
Gavin Newsom’s Podcast
📣 Call to Action:
If you found this conversation insightful, please:✅ Subscribe to Talkin' Politics & Religion Without Killin' Each Other on your favorite podcast platform.✅ Leave a review on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you listen: ratethispodcast.com/goodfaithpolitics✅ Support the show on Patreon: patreon.com/politicsandreligion✅ Watch the full conversation and subscribe on YouTube: youtube.com/@politicsandreligion
🔗 Connect With Us on Social Media
@coreysnathan:
Bluesky
LinkedIn
Instagram
Threads
Facebook
Substack
Our Sponsors:
Meza Wealth Management: www.mezawealth.com
Prolux Autogroup: www.proluxautogroup.com or www.granadahillsairporttransportation.com
Let’s keep talking politics and religion—with gentleness and respect. 🎙️💡

This conversation with David Brooks was a real highlight. We originally recorded our talk just after his most recent book HOW TO KNOW A PERSON was released. Enjoy.
 
You might recognize David Brooks from his columns in The New York Times or his essays in The Atlantic. Perhaps you’ve seen him on PBS NewsHour or Meet the Press. He’s also a prolific author. In fact, his 2019 book The Second Mountain was a major inspiration for this program. We discuss that as well as David’s new book, How to Know a Person: The Art of Seeing Others Deeply and Being Deeply Seen (Penguin Random House).
 
Our conversation with "Brooksie" went in a number of surprising directions:
Sociological observations (and confessions) of New York Mets fans;
The way lifelong friends enrich our lives;
Depression - fair warning that this section gets pretty gritty and candid;
How, as observant Jews, we both discovered Christianity later in life;
As Jews who are Christian, whether we have any ambivalence;
American Evangelicalism - talk about ambivalence!
David's writing process and the motivation of deadlines;
and much, much more!
 
Talkin' Politics & Religion Without Killin' Each Other is part of The Democracy Group, a network of podcasts that examines what’s broken in our democracy and how we can work together to fix it.
 
Please support our wonderful sponsor Meza Wealth Management:
www.mezawealth.com
 
And you can find Corey on all the socials @coreysnathan such as
www.threads.net/@coreysnathan.
 
David's new book HOW TO KNOW A PERSON: 
www.penguinrandomhouse.com/books/652822/how-to-know-a-person-by-david-brooks

In this episode, host Corey Nathan welcomes back Monica Guzmán, Senior Fellow for Public Practice at Braver Angels, host of A Braver Way podcast, CEO of Reclaim Curiosity, and author of I Never Thought of It That Way: How to Have Fearlessly Curious Conversations in Dangerously Divided Times. Monica’s mission is to help bridge America’s political divides through fearless curiosity. With deep reflections on the 2024 election, evolving friendships across ideological lines, and her renewed commitment to bridge building, Monica shares how we can stay grounded and connected—especially when it feels impossible.
What We Discuss:
How Moni processes political polarization and stays grounded—even when the world feels divided
Practical strategies for engaging with people across ideological lines without compromising your values
Why shared outrage across political lines can be a gateway to unity
The role of empathy, humility, and curiosity in depolarizing conversations
How journalists and moderators can better navigate falsehoods without censoring legitimate concerns
Episode Highlights:
[00:03:00] – Mónica explains how her emotional radar helps her know when to seek out conversations with people who see politics differently.
[00:08:00] – Unexpected agreement: conservatives and liberals are both frustrated with Congressional dysfunction and executive overreach.
[00:14:00] – Moni shares how talking with people who had different experiences during COVID reshaped her understanding and empathy.
[00:21:00] – Corey and Mónica discuss boundaries in bridge building—when is it time to walk away from a relationship?
[00:29:00] – Moderating contentious conversations: “police the structure, not the content.”
[00:36:00] – The relationship between activism and dialogue—and why one without the other can be reckless or ineffective.
[00:46:00] – Tips for recognizing quality journalism and avoiding emotionally manipulative content.
[00:56:00] – Mónica’s closing advice: engagement is not endorsement. Curiosity and conversation don’t mean you’re compromising your values.
Featured Quotes:
“I’ve been persuaded over and over again that positions against mine are not ludicrous.” – Mónica Guzmán
“Engagement is not endorsement. Having a conversation doesn’t mean you’re capitulating.” – Mónica Guzmán
“Find your edge—and push it. That’s all you need to do to build a bridge.” – Mónica Guzmán
“I don't want a decision or a position to get in the way of our relationship. I want to understand it better.” – Corey Nathan
Resources Mentioned:
I Never Thought of It That Way by Monica Guzmán - moniguzman.com/book
Braver Angels - braverangels.org
📣 Call to Action:
If you found this conversation insightful, please:✅ Subscribe to Talkin' Politics & Religion Without Killin' Each Other on your favorite podcast platform.✅ Leave a review on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you listen: ratethispodcast.com/goodfaithpolitics✅ Support the show on Patreon: patreon.com/politicsandreligion✅ Watch the full conversation and subscribe on YouTube: youtube.com/@politicsandreligion
🔗 Connect With Us on Social Media
@coreysnathan:
Bluesky
LinkedIn
Instagram
Threads
Facebook
Substack
Our Sponsors:
Meza Wealth Management: www.mezawealth.com
Prolux Autogroup: www.proluxautogroup.com or www.granadahillsairporttransportation.com
Let’s keep talking politics and religion—with gentleness and respect. 🎙️💡