Talkin‘ Politics & Religion Without Killin‘ Each Other

This is a special BONUS EPISODE of Village SquareCast. Here are the show notes from our friends at The Village Square:

"When Daryl Davis was ten, he didn’t understand hate yet. But then he was the only black scout in a parade to honor Paul Revere’s ride to Concord, when he began getting hit by bottles. It was then that he formed a question in his mind that he’s spent much of a lifetime answering: 'How can you hate me when you don’t even know me?' Failing to find his answer in books and history, as an adult and an accomplished musician, he realized who better to ask than a member of an organization formed around the premise—the KKK. So began our guest’s extraordinary story, in which a black man befriended over 200 KKK members, starting with a grand wizard. We’ll learn how his improbable, impossible, openhearted journey can light our way.

"This important programming is offered in partnership with Florida Humanities as a part of our multi-year series 'UNUM: Democracy Reignited.' Keep reading to meet our streaming partners and learn more about Mr. Davis.

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In this edition, we're joined by former U.S. Attorney, Co-host of the wonderful podcast #SistersInLaw and Legal Analyst for NBC News, Barbara McQuade. We, of course, discussed prominent legal cases such as Dominion Voting's defamation case against Fox News; Moore vs. Harper, the North Carolina case pertaining to voting law that tests the "independent state legislature theory"; the numerous cases against Donald Trump and which ones should concern him the most.

We also discussed what it's like being sworn in as U.S. Attorney on the very day the infamous "underwear bomber" attempted to blow up a plane in her jurisdiction; the importance of humanizing the victims as well as the accused as an attorney; how Barb was mentored by Jennifer Granholm who was a U.S. Attorney, then Governor of Michigan and is now the Secretary of Energy in the Biden Admin.; how the Conservative Legal Movement is distinct from Trumpism; the damage that was done to our institutions, specifically the Dept. of Justice, during the Trump Admin; whether Barb is optimistic or pessimistic about the future of our country; and much more!

Barbara McQuade is a law professor at the University of Michigan, where she teaches criminal law, criminal procedure and national security law.  She is also a legal analyst for NBC News and MSNBC and a co-host of the excellent podcast #SistersInLaw. From 2010 to 2017, Barbara served as the U.S Attorney for the Eastern District of Michigan. She was appointed by President Barack Obama, and was the first woman to serve in that position. Barbara also served as vice chair of the Attorney General’s Advisory Committee and co-chaired the Terrorism and National Security Subcommittee. Before becoming U.S. Attorney, she was an Assistant U.S. Attorney, practiced law in Detroit from 1993 to 1998, and served as a law clerk on the U.S. District Court for the Eastern District of Michigan. Professor McQuade graduated from the University of Michigan, then from the University of Michigan Law School and was born not too far away in Detroit, Michigan.

Talkin' Politics & Religion Without Killin' Each Other is part of The Democracy Group, a network of podcasts that examines what’s broken in our democracy and how we can work together to fix it. 

Be sure to check out Top of Mind with Julie Rose: www.byuradio.org/topofmind

www.politicon.com/podcast-title/sisters-in-law/

twitter.com/BarbMcQuade

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What are the most pressing concerns about the future of the American experiment and Democracy around the world? How can one person impact the many complex systems going on in the world? How can we better understand what's broken in our democracy? How can we work together to fix it? In what ways can we use the emerging medium of podcasting to explore these questions and help come up with solutions? The Democracy Group is a network of podcasts that is united around the goal of answering these questions. 

We're joined this week by Jenna Spinelle and Brandon Stover. Jenna is the Communications Specialist for the McCourtney Institute for Democracy at Penn State University and the Founder of the Democracy Group Podcast Network. Jenna also teaches journalism in the College of Communications at Penn State. Brandon Stover is the Network Manager of the Democracy Group, he is the host of the podcast Brandon Stover on Life, and he’s the Founder of Plato University where the mission is to help people find purpose and learn skills for social impact careers.

Talkin' Politics & Religion Without Killin' Each Other is part of The Democracy Group, a network of podcasts that examines what’s broken in our democracy and how we can work together to fix it. 

www.democracygroup.org

twitter.com/JennaSpinelle

democracy.psu.edu

www.brandonstover.com/podcast

www.plato.university

www.democracygroup.org/shows/talkin-politics-religion

twitter.com/coreysnathan

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This was an eye-opening conversation with Shawnee-Lenape Scholar and Author Steven T. Newcomb whose work examines Christendom’s legacy of domination and dehumanization that has resulted in the near destruction of thousands of years of spiritual and ecological wisdom developed by indigenous peoples and nations.

We discussed how much of the history and culture of original nations and peoples was systematically smothered and ultimately lost; how cutting a people off from their traditional teachings is a form of domination and dehumanization; how Old Testament religious concepts form a significant part of the backdrop of federal Indian law and policy; cognitive theory and what it has to do with the history of the United States and federal Indian law; how the American Enterprise (i.e. Empire) is predicated on the assumption of the right of domination at its root; the significance of the Johnson & Graham's Lessee vs. M'Intosh SCOTUS case of 1823 - "the cornerstone of property law in the U.S."; how the claim of the right of domination has become the organizing principle of the planet and much more.

Steven Newcomb has been studying and writing about U.S. federal Indian law and policy since the early 1980s, particularly the application of international law to Indigenous nations and peoples. Mr. Newcomb is the Director of the Indigenous Law Institute, the author of Pagans in the Promised Land: Decoding the Doctrine of Christian Discovery, and the co-producer of the documentary “The Doctrine of Discovery: Unmasking the Domination Code.” Mr. Newcomb has worked on Indigenous Peoples issues at the United Nations for twenty years. His work has been published by Wiley-Blackwell of Oxford, NYU School of Law, Fulcrum Publishing, UCLA School of Law, and the Griffith School of Law in Australia. In May 2016, Mr. Newcomb met Pope Francis at St. Peter’s Square and Archbishop Tomasi at the Pontifical Council for Justice and Peace regarding the papal bulls of the fifteenth century.

Talkin' Politics & Religion Without Killin' Each Other is part of The Democracy Group, a network of podcasts that examines what’s broken in our democracy and how we can work together to fix it. 

www.amazon.com/Pagans-Promised-Land-Christian-Discovery/dp/1555916422

vimeo.com/ondemand/dominationcode

originalfreenations.com

www.researchgate.net/publication/368661824_Redthought_Event_200_Years_Since_the_Origin_of_Federal_Indian_Law

www.democracygroup.org/shows/talkin-politics-religion

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Our guest on this episode is Lanae Erickson, SVP at Third Way, a national think tank that champions modern center-left ideas. What does it mean to be a pragmatic progressive? How can our country make pragmatic progress on important issues that's actually sustainable: Whether it's immigration, clean energy, the economy, higher education, gun safety or other social issues? Why do so many elected officials and activists treat issues most often as an all or nothing proposition? Has the Biden Administration achieved any major accomplishments? (Spoiler alert: Uh, yeah. And not so coincidentally, most of those legislative accomplishments were negotiated with bipartisan participation.) Is all compromise good? How did certain Democrats lose in Congressional districts Biden won (Eg. CA27, a Biden +12 district)? What does the current makeup of the Democratic Party look like? What about the Republican Party? Which Party is beholden to its extremist wings and which Party is led by a more pragmatic approach?

As Senior Vice President for Social Policy & Politics at Third Way, Lanae tackles hot-button issues like immigration, abortion, religious liberty, education and guns. Previously, Lanae served as a member of President Obama’s Advisory Council on Faith-Based and Neighborhood Partnerships. She was also Legislative Counsel at Alliance for Justice and before that, at the Legal Rights Center and the Center for Victims of Torture. Lanae’s commentary has been featured in The Washington Post, The New York Times, USA Today, Politico and PBS NewsHour among other outlets. She has also appeared on NPR, Fox News, CSPAN’s Washington Journal, CNN, Bloomberg Television and is a regular contributor to one of our favorite podcasts Politicology! Lanae is also the principal second violinist in DC’s Capital City Symphony.

twitter.com/LanaeErickson

www.thirdway.org

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We had a ton of questions for Kevin Singer, President of Neighborly Faith which conducts research and organizes events “introducing Christians to neighbors of every faith.” For example, considering Kevin has Jewish relatives, were there ever discussions about Jewish people's cultural allergy to proselytization and ways that American Evangelicals - perhaps unknowingly - cross that line? How does Neighborly Faith go about "train(ing) tomorrow's leaders to be faithful and flourish in an increasingly diverse world” and “knowing and serving all of our neighbors.” Is it an Evangelical bait and switch? Yaqeen Institute founder Imam Omar Suleiman said at one of NF's events, “I was and am fine with his (SBC President JD Greear) vision of the hereafter not having space for me, so long as it doesn’t become an obstacle to me having space in the here and now.” Is that part of the point of the work Neighborly Faith does? We also discussed where folks that are part of GenZ find meaning as individuals and within communities compared to previous generations?

Kevin was raised at the intersection of his mother’s Evangelical faith and his father’s Reform Jewish roots. He earned graduate degrees in Theology from Wheaton College and Higher Ed from NC State. Kevin has extensive teaching and leadership experience in churches, campus ministries, and colleges. He planted two churches with the North American Mission Board (2009-14) and is also head of Media Relations and PR at Springtide Research Institute. Kevin is a prolific writer with placements in Christianity Today, Religion News, Washington Post, Chicago Tribune, Psychology Today, InsideHigherEd, and more.

www.neighborlyfaith.org

https://www.neighborlyfaith.org/evangelicals-politics-report

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One look at the title of Rabbi Mike's book and one could understand why we loved having him on the pod! With a special return visit from Ronnie Nathan as co-host, we had a great conversation. But here's the thing, if you're one of those folks who goes by the phrase, "God said it, I believe it, that settles it" - you're gonna hate this conversation! (Oh and, bless your heart.) Aside from that, we covered a lot of ground. For example, it's okay to question the Bible and wrestle with the idea of God. A rabbi said so! We explored how the Gospels can be interpreted as anti-Jewish. We also discussed whether a Jew could believe in Jesus as the Messiah and still be Jewish.

Rabbi Michael E. Harvey is the Amazon bestselling author of Let’s Talk: A Rabbi Speaks to Christians. An ordained rabbi, he has led congregations and served as a hospital chaplain. Rabbi Mike is passionate about social justice, interfaith cooperation, and bringing deep Jewish learning to the lay public. He has followed these passions in serving his community, including founding and directing the Interfaith Council of the Caribbean as well as directing the Interfaith Leaders of Greater Lafayette. He also serves on the rabbinic advisory council of the American Jewish Archives. When he isn’t writing, Rabbi Mike can be found building community and offering a listening ear in a different kind of congregation: as a bartender in Indiana.

www.rabbimichaelharvey.com

www.rabbimichaelharvey.com/buy-the-book

twitter.com/RabbiHarvey

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Joe Walsh came back for another visit on our program and we covered a lot of ground! Can we share space with folks who have different beliefs than we do - even if they've said some egregious things in the past? If there's a line, where is that line? What does it mean to be a conservative? Is Donald Trump a real conservative? Is Ron DeSantis a conservative? What is a recipe for success for today's conservative media personalities? Is there a trick to their trade? What are effective ways of engaging folks who are still in the MAGA world? Oh, and we get pretty deep into religion too! How did studying the craft of acting prepare Joe for his future jobs as a social worker, an elected official and a radio host? What the hell is wrong in our politics and our country? Most importantly, how do we fix it? And, for the record, Helene Miller Walsh would absolutely get my vote if she ran for office!

Joe Walsh is a former U.S. Congressman, a former Presidential candidate, a nationally syndicated radio host (once dubbed “the next Rush Limbaugh), but now a man whose personal mission is to LISTEN. With his growing podcast, WHITE FLAG with JOE WALSH, he surrenders the urge to fight and strives to find a path to unite, not divide. Joe is also the author of F*ck Silence: Calling Trump Out for the Cultish, Moronic, Authoritarian Con Man He Is. He is a former Tea Party firebrand turned woke never-Trumper. He is also definitely a guy who strives to have meaningful conversations with folks from across the spectrum and yearns to give voice to so many who are somewhere in the middle.

twitter.com/WalshFreedom

linktr.ee/joewalshfreedom

pod.link/1590913798

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If you love charts, data and data analysis, you'll love this conversation. And you'll definitely love this week's guest, Washington Post national columnist Philip Bump's new book THE AFTERMATH about "the Last Days of the Baby Boom and the Future of Power in America." Our conversation covers a lot of ground including how Philip responds to stupidity in politics while still being fair and holding on to the core principles of accuracy and honesty; whether good journalists are merely "preaching to the choir" or actually persuading anyone; what the Baby Boom is and how outsized their influence is - politically and economically; whether social security is really going to run out with all the Boomers drawing on social security; what the demographic differences are between Boomers and other generations; why 4 in 10 Trump voters don't even know anyone who voted for Biden and vice versa; what trends we can reasonably expect as Boomers continue to age; and much more.

Philip Bump is a national columnist for The Washington Post; before that he led political coverage for The Atlantic Wire. One of the paper’s most read writers, he focusses on the data behind polls and political rhetoric. He has been on most major media outlets, from MSNBC’s “Morning Joe” to Fox News’s “Special Report,” and on NPR and PBS. His first book, The Aftermath: The Last Days of the Baby Boom and the Future of Power in America, looks at the overlap of the end of the baby boom and the upheaval in American politics and the U.S. economy.

www.washingtonpost.com/people/philip-bump

www.pbump.com

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twitter.com/pbump

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This is a fun conversation with tech founder and political strategist, Lucy Caldwell.

What causes some issues or politicians to have a "moment" and some others to just die on the vine? How similar is opening a major motion picture with running a political campaign? Can a case be made for open primaries and ranked-choice voting? How can one explain an elected official acting like an extremist while "representing" a purple district? Does it all come down to "algorithm politics"? What is the definition of "memetic candidates" and how bad are they for our politics? Oh, and there is some good advice for Kyrsten Sinema; a hot take or two on Sarah Palin; and some cool stories about running a presidential campaign.

Lucy Caldwell has charted a renowned career in the private & public sectors, in politics and tech. She notably served as former Congressman Joe Walsh’s campaign manager during his Presidential primary challenge against Trump and formed Mockingbird Lab to get issue-advocacy organizations to shift towards data-driven tactics. Until 2019, Lucy served as the Chief Strategy Officer & EVP at Crowdskout when the company was named the Best Advocacy Technology Platform by Campaigns & Elections Magazine. You probably recognize Lucy from her appearances on CNN, Fox News, Fox Business, and NPR or as a regular contributor on one of our favorite podcasts Politicology.

twitter.com/lucymcaldwell

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This is a special episode with Corey's cousins, the Warshawskys. Sheila, Allan, Deena and Jonathan join the pod to recount how our family had to flee Cherny Ostriv, Ukraine (then part of the Russian Empire) in 1920, travel across Europe and finally arrive in America on March 3, 1921.

It's possible that the Blicks and Krivals had been in that region for as long as 1,000 years. So what were the circumstances that led to the family's decision to leave the area where they had such deep roots? What was the trip across Europe and then the Atlantic like? How did the family re-establish itself in Newark, NJ and Brooklyn, NY? Then later (1979), what went into the decision on the part of the Warshawski cousins to make "aliyah" to Israel?

And, oh yes, we do talk about politics! Trump and Bibi Netanyahu and some other issues come up in our conversation. There's even some disagreement just to keep it fun!

This is a special episode of TP&R. We're sharing an interview Justin Peters did with Corey Nathan on Justin's excellent podcast The Struggle Is Real.

Here are the show notes from the original airing on The Struggle Is Real:

Title: How to Talk Politics and Religion Without Killing Each Other | E55 Corey Nathan

Description:

I’ve dreaded some recent get-togethers knowing argumentative political conversations are going to be on the agenda and for quite some time, I’ve taken the approach that it is better to avoid these conversations by staying quiet and giving a friendly nod.

That line of thinking is changing for me now. Avoiding participation in these conversations is forgoing the opportunity to learn something new, and maybe even change my mind. Along with that, if I’m not taking the time or initiative to understand someone else’s point of view, I’m only reinforcing the current state of divisiveness between these binary camps of blue and red.

I invited Corey Nathan on the podcast to give us inspiration on how this could be done right. He shares his personal story of making amends with his dad when he decided to leave the Jewish faith.

In the second half of this episode, Corey shares some basic communication skills to help us have more enabling conversations. Some of my favorites include the feel, felt, found framework, the phrase “help me understand”, and changing our mindset from competition to collaboration.

I hope you enjoy my conversation with the stockbroker by day, theater guy by night, Jew from Jersey that became a Christian, and the host of the incredible podcast, Talkin’ Politics & Religion Without Killin’ Each Other…Corey Nathan.

More of Corey:

Podcast: Talkin‘ Politics & Religion Without Killin‘ Each Other

https://www.politicsandreligion.us/

Instagram: @tpandrpod

More of TSIR:

Find show notes and more at https://www.tsirpodcast.com/

Follow us on Instagram at https://www.instagram.com/tsirpod/

Happy to share some of our favorite conversations from this last year. Subsequent to our talk with Christie Whitman, the former Republican Governor of New Jersey has gone on to join the Forward Party as Co-Chair along with former Democratic Presidential Candidate Andrew Yang.

In this conversation with Christine Todd Whitman, the former Governor (of the best state in the union!) and Cabinet Member, we talk about how she started her career in politics by going around the country and actually listening to people. Imagine that! We also discussed how she was able to achieve bipartisan collaboration during her 2 terms as governor of New Jersey; an assessment of how the Biden Administration is doing on climate initiatives; other achievable actions that can have a positive effect on the environment; what she's doing to resist the danger posed by candidates who are brazenly anti-democracy; the encouraging work of States United Democracy Center - "more than a think tank... an action tank"; a sober warning about current governors who are deploying the tactics of dictators; her experience with Donald Trump back when he was screwing over small contractors who built his casinos in New Jersey; and we even get to talk about religion!

Christine Todd Whitman is the Co-Founder and Co-Chair of the States United Democracy Center and she is the President of The Whitman Strategy Group. Governor Whitman served in the cabinet of President George W. Bush as Administrator of the Environmental Protection Agency and was the 50th Governor of the State of New Jersey, serving as its first woman governor. Governor Whitman also serves a number of non-profit organizations including as Chairman of the American Security Project, Vice-Chairman of the Trustees of the Eisenhower Fellowships and Advisor on Renew America Movement. Among quite a few other non-profits and causes, she was co-chair of the Commission on the Rule of Law and Democracy at the Brennan Center at New York University. Also during the 2020 election cycle she served as Chair of Republicans and Independents for Biden. And on top of all of that, she is the author of a New York Times best seller called It’s My Party Too: Taking Back the Republican Party... And Bringing the Country Together Again.

statesuniteddemocracy.org

whitmanstrategygroup.com

renewamericamovement.com

https://post.news/coreysnathan

What can happen when people from different "tribes" actually get together in person? We often jump to conclusions based merely on how someone votes. But do we take the time to understand how they arrived at that decision? How can we bring our friends and neighbors from a posture of contentiousness to one of curiosity? To put down the weapons of the culture war and pick up a cup of coffee with someone from the "other side"? Does sharing facts change people's minds? Does the tactic of dropping the perfectly worded factoid actually convince anyone of anything? Is there a line someone might cross where they're no longer a person we can even have a conversation with? We can have conversations about what is true, what is meaningful and what is useful. Is that all the same conversation?

Monica Guzman is Senior Fellow for Public Practice at Braver Angels, the nation’s largest cross-partisan grassroots organization working to depolarize America; founder and CEO of Reclaim Curiosity, an organization working to build a more curious world; and cofounder of the award-winning Seattle newsletter The Evergrey. She was a 2019 fellow at the Henry M. Jackson Foundation and a 2016 fellow at the Nieman Foundation for Journalism at Harvard University. She served twice as a juror for the Pulitzer Prize. A Mexican immigrant, Latina, and dual US/Mexico citizen, and is the author of I Never Thought of It That Way: How To Have Fearlessly Curious Conversations in Dangerously Divided Times.

https://braverangels.org/

https://www.moniguzman.com/

https://www.moniguzman.com/book

https://twitter.com/coreysnathan

This is a special bonus episode we're sharing of the Village SquareCast. The panel is titled Bridge Building and Bipartisanship.

Bridge building?!  (We’re not talking about the Golden Gate, people.)  An industry that was recently unknown and almost nonexistent has exploded in recent years, as average citizens begin to see the sharp growth in political divisions as an emergency that requires our attention. In the midst of a divisive election season, we’ll take a pause to chat with leaders in the bridge building field about the outlook for cooperation across political differences and potential improvements on the horizon that we can all reach for.

Is there hope of a tipping point where bridge-building is more prominent than the divide-and-(attempt to)-conquer approach of late?  Might average Americans like our heroic guests and listeners have to roll up their sleeves and show our politicians the way?

Speaking of the politicians:  stay tuned until the end to learn about the Common Ground Scorecard where you can find out which candidates on your ballot are interested in bridging divides. #Mavericks

Joining the conversation are Pearce Godwin, Founder & CEO of Listen First Project; Kristin Hansen, Executive Director of Civic Health Project; and Liz Joyner, Founder and President of The Village Square.

Listen First Project leads the collaborative movement to heal America by bridging divides. They elevate the impact, visibility, and voice of the bridge-building field by aggregating, aligning, and amplifying the efforts of 500 #ListenFirst Coalition partner organizations into large scale, national campaigns and strategies. Together these organizations transform division and contempt into connection and understanding.

Civic Health Project is dedicated to reducing America’s toxic partisan polarization and enabling healthier public discourse and decision-making across our citizenry, politics, and media. Through grantmaking, advocacy, and convenings, Civic Health Project supports the most promising research and interventions to reduce political division and foster social cohesion across the country.

This episode is part of The Democracy Group’s 2022 Midterm Series.

In this coversation with columnist, public speaker, recovering attorney and playwright, Wajahat Ali, we discuss what it's like to live in a country you love that doesn't always love you back; representation and how often different folks are portrayed as invisible, the sidekick, the punchline or the villain; how it was to be the only Muslim kid going to a Jesuit Catholic H.S.; seeing the common values and stories in both the Bible and the Koran; what it was like, as a Muslim who was born here and grew up here, after 9/11; the dangers in turning our prophets into nothing more than mascots; the tendency to "sell Jesus" with the selling points being the promise of having white teeth, a mansion and a yacht; and so much more.

Wajahat Ali is a Daily Beast columnist and co-host of the excellent podcast democracy-ish. His first book Go Back To Where You Came From: And, Other Helpful Recommendations on Becoming American was published in January of 2022. He is all about sharing stories that are by us, for everyone: universal narratives told through a culturally specific lens to entertain, educate and bridge the global divides. You may have seen or heard Wajahat on television and podcasts for his brilliant, incisive, and witty political commentary. His essays, interviews, and reporting have appeared in The New York Times, The Atlantic, The Washington Post, Guardian, and New York Review of Books.

www.wajali.com/

www.dcpofficial.com/democracy-ish

www.amazon.com/dp/0393867978/

In this roundtable discussion, we're joined by two friends of the pod, Lori Adams-Brown of A World of Difference and Will Wright of Faithful Politics. We discuss what we got right (and wrong) about the Midterms? What does it all mean for our Democracy? And we begin to take a look ahead to the coming legislative session as well as to 2024.

Lori Adams-Brown is a combination of international speaker, business executive, podcaster and relief and development expert. She hosts the popular podcast A World of Difference, celebrating humanity’s unique differences and encouraging us all to make a difference around the world.  Since growing up in international schools in Costa Rica and Venezuela, Lori has spent her career working in Indonesia, Singapore and the San Francisco Bay Area.  She worked in disaster relief in the 2004 Indonesian tsunami where she consulted with the UN coordination efforts, and she has spoken to audiences in Singapore, Indonesia, Brunei, Thailand, Malaysia, Venezuela and around the US.  Lori speaks 6 languages, and serves on the board of Justice Revival, and volunteers to help resettle Afghan refugees in the SF Bay Area.

Will Wright has been interested in politics his whole life. He elected not to run for any office because in the third grade his teacher told him that Black people could never be president (true story). But in 2001 after the world trade center towers collapsed, Will felt the need to do something, so he enlisted in the United States Army as an Infantryman. His unit was one of the initial pushes into the streets of Iraq, during Operation Iraqi Freedom. After leaving the service, Will traveled the world as a consultant which is where he really experienced how the world works and got the idea to start a podcast that centers around faith and politics. His political leanings tend to favor Democratic policies, but he has voted for Democrats, Libertarians, and Republicans. He wishes that problems could be fixed by civil dialogue, and hopes his podcast - which is called Faithful Politics - can exemplify what that conversation can look like in the world.

https://a-world-of-difference.captivate.fm

www.faithfulpoliticspodcast.com

https://justicerevival.org

Robert Draper is a contributing writer for the New York Times Magazine and National Geographic Magazine. He is the author of several books, including the New York Times bestseller, Dead Certain: The Presidency of George W. Bush and his latest book Weapons of Mass Delusion: When the Republican Party Lost Its Mind.

In this episode we explore a number of pressing questions: What are some characteristics of the "mass delusion" that currently plagues our country? Who is a part of it? Who's responsible for it? Will the results of these midterms start to dissipate the MAGA movement? How could Republican leaders and Republican candidates manage to win in primaries and keep the MAGA base without turning off the general electorate? Is it even possible? Where did this notion begin and who is perpetuating the idea that Democrats are bad people and possibly even evil? As a journalist who'd been to war zones all over the world, what was it like to witness first hand the events of January 6th? What are the beliefs and motivations that drive people to participate in the kind of violence that occurred on that day? What were some of the revelations and conclusions that came out of Robert's dinner with MTG? Trump isn't the world's greatest deal maker afterall (go figure). But which two great deals did he make that can explain his takeover of the Republican Party? What was it like getting to know a leader affiliated with the Oath Keepers? Many of the answers to these questions may be very surprising.

www.nytimes.com/by/robert-draper

www.penguinrandomhouse.com/books/688795/weapons-of-mass-delusion-by-robert-draper/

twitter.com/DraperRobert

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Which states are the bellwethers in the upcoming election? Which states will give the clearest indication of the direction of the House and Senate? Who is showing up to vote that pollsters weren't expecting? And how will those voters who aren't considered "likely voters" change the results? How does a firm like Decision Desk HQ gather the information needed to make election calls as quickly as they do? (Answer: There are 50 states with 50 different ways to get the information.) What is a model? How are election models different from polls? What factors are considered to develop a model? What are some of the differences between DDHQ's model and other models such as fivethirtyeight's? How should we look at projections? We explore these questions and more with DDHQ's Senior Data Scientist Kiel Williams.

Kiel Williams is a Senior Data Scientist at Decision Desk HQ. Decision Desk HQ collects, organizes, and reports election night results and provides election related data to media outlets, political organizations, and anyone interested in who votes and how they voted. Kiel specifically performs electoral analysis, polling and manages data operations at DDHQ. Kyle has an undergraduate degree in physics and math from Guilford College and earned his PhD in physics from the University of Illinois, Urbana Champaign.

decisiondeskhq.com/

twitter.com/DecisionDeskHQ

twitter.com/KielTWilliams

twitter.com/coreysnathan

What is an "Evangelical Entrepreneur"? There is a long history of Evangelical Entrepreneurs in this country. We trace a long line of leading figures from the likes of Dwight L. Moody to Billy Sunday to Billy Graham and Jerry Falwell to Paula White and Robert Jeffress. Are there common themes and grievances in the messages of these leaders that we're still hearing today? What are some of the hallmarks of Evangelicalism that led to its close alignment with the Republican Party? What do Evangelicals see in Donald Trump? We explore all that and more in this conversation with David Clary.

David Clary is an award-winning author and news editor at The San Diego Union-Tribune. Clary’s latest book is Soul Winners: The Ascent of America’s Evangelical Entrepreneurs, which we discuss at length in this episode. David's previous book, Gangsters to Governors: The New Bosses of Gambling in America, explores how and why states have encouraged and promoted the expansion of legalized gambling in America. Interestingly, that book was cited five times in the U.S. Supreme Court’s majority opinion that struck down the federal ban on sports gambling in May 2018. Before joining the Union-Tribune in 2002, David worked in a variety of editing and design roles at The Plain Dealer in Cleveland. He is a native of Central New York and studied Journalism and PoliSci at Syracuse University.

www.sandiegouniontribune.com

www.davidclaryauthor.com/

julieroys.com/

twitter.com/coreysnathan

We're joined by Lincoln Project Sr. Advisor Stuart Stevens and cover a lot of ground. What have been the 2 dominant genes of the Republican Party going back to post-WWII? And which one won? What does the guy who got more Republican politicians elected than just about anybody think of the state of the Party? What was the 2016 election really about? What are all the baseless claims of election fraud in 2020 really about? How do modern democracies die? How can the Republican Party be cured of all that is wrong with it? What has the Lincoln Project done to address the issues that arose at the end of 2020 and early 2021? What is the Lincoln Project doing now to save our democracy?

Stuart Stevens is a seventh generation Mississippian who has been driven by a fascination and love of politics, film, and writing and has pursued those interests throughout his life. Stuart did a lot of school, having attended Oxford; Middlebury College, UCLA Film School’s MFA program, and the American Film Institute. He is the author of eight books including his latest, published in 2020, It Was All a Lie: How the Republican Party Became Donald Trump. His work has appeared in The New York Times, The Washington Post and Esquire, among other publications. He has written extensively for television shows, including Northern Exposure, Commander in Chief, and K Street. For twenty-five years, he was the lead strategist and media consultant for some of the nation’s toughest political campaigns including 5 presidential campaigns. In 4 of those campaigns, his candidate became the nominee. And in 2 of them, they won "the big enchilada". Stuart's had a long time interest in endurance sports which, as he says, he pursues badly. Stuart has been a Senior Advisor with the Lincoln Project since 2020.

https://lincolnproject.us/

https://www.stuartstevens.com/

https://twitter.com/stuartpstevens

bit.ly/itwasallalie

https://twitter.com/coreysnathan

Hopefully this conversation with Reverend Dr. Jacqui Lewis will be as much of a gift to you as it was for me. We explored some deep questions like, What was the failure of the people of Israel around the time of Yeshua ben Yosef? Is our own generation also failing Jesus as Messiah? What does it mean to be a "drum major for peace"? What is the church's culpability in racism? What is ubiquitously God's call on our life - whether we're Muslim, Jewish, Christian, Bantu, Sikh, or any other faith? What does it mean to be a theologian in residence in one's own life?

The REV. DR. JACQUI LEWIS is Senior Minister and Minister for Vision, Worship, and the Arts at Middle Collegiate Church, a church that was founded in 1628 and one of the oldest continuous Protestant congregations in North America; and she is Executive Director and Co-Founder of The Middle Project which, along with Middle Church, hosted fifteen annual conferences to train faith leaders to combat racism, poverty and bigotry by growing multiethnic congregations that work for justice. Rev. Dr. Lewis is a prolific author, her latest book teaches us how to love the hell out of the world. It’s called Fierce Love: A Bold Path to Ferocious Courage and Rule-Breaking Kindness That Can Heal the World.

https://jacquijlewis.com/

https://www.middlechurch.org/

https://www.middleproject.org/

https://jacquijlewis.com/fierce-love/

https://twitter.com/RevJacquiLewis

https://www.instagram.com/revjacquilewis/

https://twitter.com/coreysnathan

If you're a political junkie like me, this conversation will knock your socks off! Joe Trippi and Mike Madrid, one long time Democratic strategist, one long time Republican strategist discuss how DEMOCRACY IS ON THE BALLOT (and how 67% of BOTH Republicans and Democrats believe this). We also get into how candidates who have huge scandals (clears throat... did someone say "Herschel Walker"?) are able to stay in their races (and sometimes even get a bump!); what a "Bannon line" voter is and how to win them; where the real tossup races are in the House and Senate; what happened to the party that used to stand up to Russia that's now an extension of Putin's propoganda operation; what the most important hidden metric is that no one is paying attention to (Hint: It's neither the generic ballot nor presidential approval); what the best political strategists in the country are doing at this stage of the campaign; and much, much more!

Many know Joe Trippi from his excellent podcast, That Trippi Show. Joe’s been running political campaigns at every level in U.S. politics and even internationally, starting in city politics in Northern California and then jumping into the big leagues on Ted Kennedy’s campaign for the Democratic nomination for President in 1980. Joe’s also been involved in some groundbreaking “bottom up” strategies along the way like when he ran Governor Howard Dean’s grassroots presidential campaign in 2004. More recently, he helped Doug Jones, a Democrat, win the Alabama Senate seat, the first Democrat to get elected to the Senate in Alabama in decades. Joe has also joined Lincoln Project to "build a pro-democracy coalition."

Mike Madrid is a national political strategist, an expert in demographics and Latino politics. Mike’s academic work on Latino politics became the foundation for groundbreaking communications and outreach strategies in California, Texas, Florida and nationwide. Later, Mike was a co-founder of the Lincoln Project which played a significant part in defeating Donald Trump. Mike also lectures on race, class and partisanship at USC and he’s a regular contributor on one of our favorite programs Politicology with Ron Steslow. He is the co-host of the excellent and timely podcast The Latino Vote along with Chuck Rocha. Mike also hosts the program Mike Drop on the CallIn app which is then released as a podcast. And most notably, Mike Madrid is the first guest ever to score a hat trick on the TP&R pod!

https://twitter.com/JoeTrippi

https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/that-trippi-show/id1523896927

https://twitter.com/madrid_mike

https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-latino-vote/id1613279254

https://www.callin.com/show/mike-drop-WBRuydpbns

https://twitter.com/coreysnathan

In this conversation with Catherine Manfre, author of the new book Not There Yet: Living Through Egypt, Love and Uncertainty, we discuss how 9/11 shaped Catherine and changed the course of her life; the importance of being an ally against bigotry even in moments when no one else is watching; how to confront prejudice in more productive, persuasive ways; strong women leaders in Egypt who lead their own movement; when the systems that are supposed to be established for justice fail us; how often women need to put their lives and their bodies on the line for what is right (not just in Egypt and the U.S., but in the protests in Iran today); having lived through the revolution in Egypt in 2011, how the events here in the States after the 2020 election leading up to Jan. 6th and beyond really hit hard; how the government in Egypt would use tactics like manipulating the media, finding scapegoats real or imagined, and sparking political violence and how there's an eerie similarity to what some leaders and elected officials have resorted to here in the States; and that if we can't find common ground, it's going to be difficult for us to get through life together as one united country.

Catherine Manfre is a business and strategy advisor and consultant with an MBA from the University of Virginia, Darden School of Business and a BA in Middle Eastern and Islamic Studies from NYU. She has advised private and public sector organizations on a range of business and management challenges and is passionate about solving the hardest, most difficult problems. She lived in Cairo, Egypt for four years where she learned Arabic, met her husband, and became an Egyptian street food connoisseur. 

Voice of Freedom - www.youtube.com/watch?v=sV9UY_8qABY

www.amazon.com/Not-There-Yet-Through-Uncertainty-ebook/dp/B0BDQQTV6P

In this conversation with Reed Howard of the Millennial Action Project we discuss his experience as a millennial who identified as a Republican but then had to figure out how he could move forward in his party in the age of Trump; going to divinity school to study why evangelical voters were so drawn to Donald Trump; the perils of making politics one's religion; how elite level communications tell people how to think and feel about important issues like abortion, same sex marriage and even democracy itself; creating space to have cross-partisan conversations; what Reed really thinks of 3rd party efforts; his concern that if Republicans abandon the Republican Party, it will result in more illiberalism and more of a threat; how folks can get involved in campaigns and their political party; and methods of talking to persuadable voters about supporting candidates and issues they haven't supported in the past.

Reed Howard is the Senior Director of Communications at the Millennial Action Project, which activates young leaders to bridge the partisan divide and transform American politics. Reed is a strategist and practitioner at the intersection of democracy reform, cross-partisan politics, and faith who has advised the nation’s leading nonprofits, political organizations, and public figures on how to engage America’s young people across the political spectrum. Reed led communications at Georgetown’s Institute of Politics and Public Service. He worked with Joe Biden’s 2020 presidential campaign to reach Republican voters; he is a member of the American Enterprise Institute’s Millennial Leadership Network, the Board of Directors for Republican Women for Progress, and the senior leadership team of Principles First. He served as a minister at Central United Methodist Church in downtown Atlanta, and currently serves as a chaplain-in-residence at Georgetown University.

https://twitter.com/ReedHowardVA

https://www.millennialaction.org/

https://twitter.com/MActionProject

https://www.nationalaffairs.com/publications/detail/the-future-is-faction

Christy Smith is campaigning to represent CA27 in the U.S. House of Representatives. The current Congressman, Republican Mike Garcia won the district in 2020 by 333 votes out of over 340,000 that were cast. Yet Mike’s voting record and public statements while in office have represented only the most extreme MAGA fringe and not the entirety of this very purple district. 

In this conversation with Christy, we discuss a wide range of issues from saving our democratic institutions to student debt relief, environmental issues to education, and we even discuss her position on providing police and first responders with the resources they need. We also discussed the politics of 2022 including how it's different campaigning this year vs. 2020; Christy shares how she's connecting with folks such as college-educated women in her district, many of whom have never voted for a Democrat before; she also specifies ways she's reaching out to another important constituency of CA27, Latinos; and we talk candidly about how her opponent Mike Garcia, despite his campaign promises to be a moderate, has actually governed as an extremist kowtowing only to the MAGA fringe of his Party.

Christy has a long track record in public service in the district she hopes to represent in Congress. While serving in the CA State Assembly, Christy authored nine bills which became law focusing on education reform, homeowner protections, college affordability, good governance and protection for victims of human trafficking. Prior to the State Assembly, Christy served two terms as a Governing Board Member of the Newhall School District, notably helping to secure $60 million in resources for facility and technology upgrades for the school district. It’s also worth noting that Christy graduated high school in Santa Clarita, went to College of the Canyons (before graduating from UCLA) and has also raised a family in the Santa Clarita Valley.

https://www.christyforcongress.org/

https://twitter.com/ChristySmithCA

https://www.politicsandreligion.us

https://twitter.com/coreysnathan

This is a bonus TP&R episode of Freedom Road Podcast with our friend and colleague Lisa Sharon Harper and her guest the Rev. Dr. Otis Moss III. 

Listen in as Lisa Sharon Harper and Rev. Dr. Otis Moss III do this deep dive on the meaning of and the hunger for the unfettered right to vote in the United States of America.

Freedom Road Podcast brings together national faith leaders, advocates, and front-lines activists for candid conversations about the pressing issues of our times.

Lisa Sharon Harper leads trainings that increase clergy and community leaders’ capacity to organize people of faith toward a just world. A prolific speaker, writer and activist, Ms. Harper is the founder and president of FreedomRoad.us, a consulting group dedicated to shrinking the narrative gap in our nation by designing forums and experiences that bring common understanding, common commitment and common action.

With civil rights advocacy in his DNA, Rev. Dr. Otis Moss III built his ministry on community advancement and social justice activism. As Senior Pastor of Trinity United Church of Christ in Chicago, Illinois, Dr. Moss spent the last two decades practicing and preaching a Black theology that unapologetically calls attention to the problems of mass incarceration, environmental justice, and economic inequality.

https://freedomroad.us/

https://freedomroad.us/category/freedom-road-podcast/

https://twitter.com/lisasharper

https://twitter.com/om3

https://twitter.com/coreysnathan

Peter Wehner is a contributing editor at The Atlantic and contributing writer to the New York Times which is where he wrote a column in January of 2016 that he would not be voting for Donald Trump under any circumstances. Pete is also the author of The Death of Politics: How to Heal Our Frayed Republic After Trump. Earlier in his career, Pete worked in the Reagan and George H.W. Bush Administrations. In the George W. Bush White House, Pete was deputy director of speechwriting before becoming director of the Office of Strategic Initiatives. Additionally, he was involved in President Bush’s 2004 re-election campaign as well as Mitt Romney’s 2012 presidential campaign. 

Pete and Corey talked about the virtue of grace; the catastrophic effect that the failures of leaders such as Ravi Zacharias and others have had on the church; the marriage of American Christianity with Christian nationalism; what it means to be a "theoretical pessimist but an operational optimist"; how we can fight against the influence of those who can't be reached by reality while persuading those who can; and more broadly how to have healthier encounters among folks who disagree.

https://www.amazon.com/Death-Politics-Frayed-Republic-After/dp/1982661798

https://www.nytimes.com/column/peter-wehner

https://www.theatlantic.com/author/peter-wehner/

Would you consider becoming one of our patrons? 

https://patron.podbean.com/politicsandreligion

With Danielle Moodie, we get into a range of pressing topics. Lots of politics and culture but also a dash of religion such as how Danielle connects with a higher power without needing to go to a specific place or read a specific text. We also discuss the importance of recognizing systemic failures and being a part of the "democracy perfection marathon"; how Danielle's not asking people to deny their own stories but to be honest about the story of this nation; the differences between conversation and debate, and being right vs. opening our minds; how to overcome the dangerous tendency to dehumanize those we think are on "the other side" and so much more.

Danielle Moodie is the host of Woke AF, where she explores the many facets of what it means to be "woke" in our modern life. Danielle also co-hosts democracy-ish with Wajahat Ali, a podcast dedicated to fighting for democracy and preserving your sanity in a time when both are under active assault. Never shy about shaking things up and calling out BS where she sees it, Danielle has been an unapologetic commentator about America’s racism problem. A former (and self-proclaimed recovering) lobbyist turned media maven, her opinions and cultural commentary have been published in a variety of outlets, including Daily Beast, Medium’s Zora Magazine, Cosmopolitan, Vogue, Essence, The Atlantic, Ebony, Huffington Post, and others. She also makes frequent appearances on MSNBC, CBC, PBS, and BBC America.

https://twitter.com/DeeTwoCents

www.dcpofficial.com/woke-af

www.dcpofficial.com/democracy-ish

In this lively and fun dialogue, this week's guest, Timber Hawkeye shares why Buddhism attracted him most - that is, Buddhism didn't pretend to have answers. We discuss how to have conversations with people who see things differently than we do; how "to love more people, not less"; the concept of where we get the foundation of our moral ethical structure and, as Timber said, "I don't care if you get it from Jesus or Buddha or your Aunt Bettie"; how "the word 'should' is the most hostile word in our language"; and, of course, we get into Timber's fascinating journey among so much more.

Timber Hawkeye is the bestselling author of BUDDHIST BOOT CAMP; FAITHFULLY RELIGIONLESS; and the recently released THE OPPOSITE OF NAMASTE. His books and the Buddhist Boot Camp Podcast offer a secular and non-sectarian approach to being at peace with the world (both within and around us), with the intention to awaken, enlighten, enrich and inspire.

www.buddhistbootcamp.com/

www.buddhistbootcamp.com/books

In this special episode, Lori Adams-Brown and Corey talk a great deal about Lori and her husband Jason's experience with spiritual abuse while working at Echo Church under Pastor Andy Wood. In an astonishing turn of events, Wood was hired as Rick Warren's successor at megachurch Saddleback. (To this date, Saddleback has not reversed - one could say "repented of" - their decision to hire Andy Wood. In fact, the tactics the church leaders have deployed to dismiss the charges and even vilify those who've come forward with credible accounts of abuse is chilling.)

But that's not all we discussed. We also covered Lori's remarkable background having grown up as a "missionary kid" in different parts of the world; her incredible experience over the course of many years aiding in disaster relief; how Lori is now helping others through her coaching and mentoring practice; ways we Christians can decolonize through "cultural humility"; how certain churches pressure or coerce exiting employees into signing Non-Disclosure Agreements (aka NDAs); how systems in the Evangelical Industrial Complex are designed for narcissists to come in; and so much more.

Lori Adams-Brown is a combination of international speaker, business executive, podcaster, and relief and development expert. She hosts a wonderful podcast called A World of Difference, celebrating humanity’s unique differences and encouraging us all to make a difference around the world.  Since growing up in international schools in Costa Rica and Venezuela, Lori has spent her career working in Indonesia, Singapore and the San Francisco Bay Area.  She worked in disaster relief in the 2004 Indonesian tsunami where she consulted with the UN coordination efforts, and she has spoken to audiences all over the U.S. and all around the world.  Lori also speaks 6 languages, and brings a rare multicultural perspective to all her work.

www.loriadamsbrown.com

a-world-of-difference.captivate.fm

julieroys.com/former-staffers-expose-bullying-rick-warren-successor-andy-wood/

religionnews.com/2022/08/01/church-conflict-or-spiritual-abuse-saddleback-echo-wood-driscoll-reyes/

Much of our conversation with Dr. Paul D. Miller is about his recent book THE RELIGION OF AMERICAN GREATNESS: WHAT'S WRONG WITH CHRISTIAN NATIONALISM. Over the course of our talk, we do a deep dive into the very definition of Nationalism and Christian Nationalism; the difference between tribal evangelicalism and biblical Christianity; how jazz was used as an example by Rich Lowry of National Review to make an argument FOR Nationalism that Dr. Miller then uses to make quite a thorough argument AGAINST Nationalism; the particular chauvinism of Christian Nationalists; the blasphemy of the insurrectionists who invoked God's name in the midst of a terrorist attack on January 6th; and, yes, we did talk about what Professor Miller meant when he said he would not want to live in a country where drag queens were barred by law from going to the library or hosting an event. 

Dr. Miller is a political theorist and political scientist focusing on international affairs, the American experiment, and America’s role in the world. Previously, he spent a decade in public service as Director for Afghanistan and Pakistan on the National Security Council staff under both President George W. Bush and President Barack Obama. He was also an intelligence analyst for the CIA and a military intelligence officer in the U.S. Army. He is currently a Professor of the Practice of International Affairs at Georgetown University. He is also a research fellow with the Ethics and Religious Liberty Commission and a visiting professor with the American Enterprise Institute’s Initiative on Faith and Public Life. Dr. Miller writes widely on international affairs, political theory, religion and public life, and film and culture. In addition to his most recent book, The Religion of American Greatness, he is also the author of Just War and Ordered Liberty; American Power and Liberal Order; and Armed State Building. More of his writing has appeared in the Washington Post, The New Republic, Mere Orthodoxy, The American Interest, The World Affairs Journal and quite a few other publications. Dr. Miller holds a PhD in international relations and a BA in government from Georgetown, and a master in public policy from Harvard University.

https://www.pauldavidmiller.com/

https://www.amazon.com/Religion-American-Greatness-Christian-Nationalism-ebook/dp/B09MSNPQZ4/

Danny Cevallos is a legal analyst for NBC and MSNBC and co-founder of the law firm Cevallos & Wong, LLP. He focuses his practice in the areas of state, federal, and territorial criminal defense and civil litigation. Danny also handles wrongful conviction and malicious prosecution cases; he has handled a number of high profile cases in the federal, state, and territorial courts, ranging from white collar criminal matters to first-degree murder cases; and you may have previously seen him as a Legal Analyst at CNN, HLN and TruTV and as a regular on shows such as Erin Burnett OutFront and AC 360 with Anderson Cooper. But perhaps most impressive is Danny’s distinction as a 7x winner of a 10 out of 10 rating on Rate my Skype Room!

We dove into a number of the pressing legal issues at center stage in our politics including "the real story" of the Dobbs decision overturning Roe v Wade; the legal doctrine of "substantive due process" and whether cases pertaining to same sex marriage, contraception and sexual intimacy by same sex couples will come into question; the Texas statute that deputizes the entire citizenry of the state as a means of enforcing abortion restrictions; whether or not the conservative Justices on the Court want to be in the business of making law; the effectiveness of the January 6th hearings; and what's at the core of the criminality of Trump's actions pertaining to Jan. 6th. We also discuss a highly recommended podcast called WHY DON'T WE KNOW with host Sara Ganim; and we even talk about how everyone in Corey's family (including Corey!) has a crush on Anderson Cooper.

https://dannycevallos.com/

https://cevalloswong.com/

https://whydontweknow.com/

Miles Taylor served in the White House, initially in the George W. Bush administration and then later during Donald Trump’s presidency. He was brought into the Department of Homeland Security as a Senior Advisor to General John Kelly and then became Chief of Staff of that Department under Secretary Kirstjen Nielsen. Miles is also known as “Anonymous” - the writer of the infamous New York Times OpEd and later the bestselling book A Warning, sounding the alarm about the chaos of the Trump White House and the amorality of Trump himself. Miles later contributed to the efforts of Republican Voters Against Trump and then went on to Co-found and is the Executive Director of the Renew America Movement, an organization committed to supporting principled Democrats, Republicans and Independents in the upcoming elections as well as shedding light on extremist candidates who are a danger to our democracy.

In this candid conversation we discuss how surreal the extremism that dominates political engagement today would have seemed 10 years ago; his concern about the looming threat of political assassinations; the reality that the universe doesn't "bend" but that "we bend it"; his advocacy for democratic reforms such as ranked choice voting and open primaries; how different the Trump Administration was compared with the George W. Bush (or any other) Administration; how Donald Trump turned the Oval Office into an echo chamber; and much more.

renewamericamovement.com

www.nytimes.com/2018/09/05/opinion/trump-white-house-anonymous-resistance.html

www.amazon.com/dp/B07YL2GR4G/ref=dp-kindle-redirect?_encoding=UTF8&btkr=1

rvat.org

Ali Noorani is a Fellow at the Arizona State University Social Transformation Lab and the new program director for U.S. Democracy at the Hewlett Foundation and author of “There Goes the Neighborhood: How Communities Overcome Prejudice and Meet the Challenge of American Immigration” and his new book “Crossing Borders: The Reconciliation of a Nation of Immigrants.” Previously, Ali served as president & chief executive officer of the National Immigration Forum for 14 years. Ali has appeared in the majority of mainstream television, radio and print outlets and is a regular speaker at conferences and campuses across the country. Having worked with faith, law enforcement and business leaders to promote the value of immigrants and immigration, Ali is known as one of the nation’s most creative coalition builders. He is also a member of the Council on Foreign Relations, holds a Master’s in Public Health from Boston University and is a graduate of the University of California, Berkeley.

We discuss a number of pressing issues including when Latino support peaked for Democrats and why they've begun losing significant percentages of that support; how the National Immigration Forum appealed to conservatives and moderates during the Trump era on immigration issues based on conservatives' values; he shares that the point of our immigration policy, at times, has been cruelty, but by depriving others of their dignity, it's a reflection of our own dignity; he talks about outreach they did with Evangelical women, how they were asking tough questions about immigration but didn't have a place to explore those questions; how to have grace in conversations across differences; and much more.

https://alinoorani.org/

https://alinoorani.org/crossing-borders/

https://hewlett.org/

Rick Wilson, co-founder of The Lincoln Project, knows today's Republican Party better than just about anyone from having run GOP campaigns for decades. But Rick was an early and vocal critic of Donald Trump which ultimately cost him a great deal in the Trump era. He also co-founded @ProjectLincoln to help defeat Trump in 2020. We discuss all that as well as how TLP addressed the problems that were revealed about the organization in late 2020. We also talk about what Democrats need to do in 2022 and beyond.

Rick Wilson is a renowned Republican political strategist and infamous negative ad maker getting his start on Connie Mack’s Senate campaign in 1988 as well as on the Presidential campaign of George H.W. Bush that same year. Since that time he’s been the key advisor to political candidates, SuperPACS, state parties and the national campaign committees. Rick is also a writer, speaker and commentator who regularly appears on national news networks including CNN and MSNBC, shows such as Real Time with Bill Maher, and has had columns published in The Daily Beast, The Washington Post, Politico, Rolling Stone, USA Today, The Hill and The Bulwark among others. Rick is also the author of Everything Trump Touches Dies (a NYT #1 bestseller) and Running Against the Devil which came out in January of 2020.

Shoutout to our friends at The Village Square right in Rick's neck of the woods, Tallahassee, FL. They have a great podcast called Village SquareCast.

www.therickwilson.com/about/

https://lincolnproject.us/

https://tlh.villagesquare.us/squarecast/

https://twitter.com/TheRickWilson

https://twitter.com/projectlincoln

https://twitter.com/VillageSquareFL

Will Saletan, writer for THE BULWARK, came in for a conversation about a range of issues including what's really important; how the scientific method compares with our political way of behaving; how traffic rewards the wings; the culture of authority; recognizing our biases; the proclivity of deploying rhetoric in bad faith; the significance of what's happening in Ukraine; why he made the move from SLATE to the THE BULWARK; and how his own writing process has evolved.

William Saletan wrote for SLATE for 25 years contributing over 2,700 pieces for the daily online magazine. He’s also the author of BEARING RIGHT: HOW CONSERVATIVES WON THE ABORTION WAR. Will is now a writer at THE BULWARK who, as he says, questions everything.

Lisa Sharon Harper is Founder of Freedom Road, a consulting group which leads trainings all around the globe that increase clergy and community leaders’ capacity to organize people of faith toward a just world. Ms. Harper is a critically acclaimed author of several books including her latest, Fortune: How Race Broke My Family and the World and How to Repair It All, which we discuss in this episode. Ms. Harper earned her Masters degree in Human Rights from Columbia University, is an Auburn Theological Seminary Senior Fellow and served as Sojourners Chief Church Engagement Officer. We were also grateful to have special co-host Will Chan Wright of Faithful Politics join us for this in-depth conversation.

This is a bonus TP&R episode of Faithful Politics with our good friends Josh Burtram and Will Wright when they interviewed Amanda Carpenter of The Bulwark.

Gaslighting is a tactic in which a person or entity, in order to gain more power, makes a victim question their reality. Enter former-President Trump. Over the last four years, America has been under the influence of a person who seemingly graduated from Gaslighting University with a Ph.D. in Alternative Facts. Whether Trump knows it or not, he is masterful in the art of gaslighting-jitsu. The guest this week may know a thing or two about being gaslit, as she has been the target of this Trump tactic, Amanda Carpenter joins Will and Josh to discuss her book, Gaslighting America: Why We Love It When Trump Lies to Us. They also discuss the future of the Republican Party, and how faith played a key role in her life during one of the most heinous acts perpetrated by the Trump campaign during 2016 primaries.

Amanda Carpenter is a political commentator for CNN and author of GASLIGHTING AMERICA: Why We Love It When Trump Lies To Us. Prior to CNN she was the Communications Director for Senator Ted Cruz and previously served as Senior Communications Advisor and Speechwriter to Sen. Jim DeMint.

For both senators, Carpenter crafted countless op-eds, speeches, talking points, briefing papers, jokes, press releases, tweets, Facebook posts, and other materials on a range of subjects before the United States Senate, including but not limited to economics, campaigns, healthcare, foreign affairs, and constitutional matters. Her work for them has been published in the Wall Street Journal, New York Times, Washington Post, and other outlets.

Roll Call featured her in a 2014 front-page profile, "Ted Cruz's Twitter Torrent: Outspoken GOP Aide Takes on Own Party" calling her "Capitol Hill's most-followed staffer" on Twitter with more than 56,000 followers.

In 2013, she led the creation of Cruz’s viral #MakeDCListen speech and campaign that pollster Frank Luntz said produced "the best political sound-byte of 2013.” In 2011, she was named by the Washington Post as one of the "Top 10 Capitol Hill Staffers to Watch." 

https://www.faithfulpoliticspodcast.com/

https://www.thebulwark.com/author/amanda-carpenter/

https://www.barnesandnoble.com/w/gaslighting-america-amanda-carpenter/1126314531?ean=9780062748003

Susan Del Percio is a highly accomplished political strategist and crisis communications consultant who is a political analyst for MSNBC as well as a contributor to Know Your Value - Mika Brzezinski's initiative that is helping women to grow their career, form healthy habits and reach their full potential. Susan is also a regular on one of our favorite podcasts Politicology. Appointed as a Special Advisor to Governor Andrew Cuomo in 2014, she initiated and implemented communication strategies, and advised and developed policy initiatives. Susan also served as Deputy Commissioner in the Giuliani Administration prior to founding her firm in 2001 which serves private corporate clients, leading elected officials, political organizations and candidates as well as non-profits. Susan is also a Distinguished Lecturer at Emerson College where she received both her Bachelor and Master’s degrees.

In this conversation we cover a lot of ground including the sad decline of Rudy Giuliani as someone who worked for him when he was Mayor of NYC; how it was to go to work for a Democratic Governor after having been in Republican politics; her experience of being in New York on 9/11 and what it was like in the days and weeks after that historic day; what it cost her, as a longtime Republican strategist, to be an early critic of Donald Trump and Trumpism; we get into one of our favorite pods Politicology, of course; whether the GOP can be redeemed; and Susan gives some candid advice to Democrats for the 2022 midterms and beyond.

https://twitter.com/DelPercioS

https://www.msnbc.com/knowyourvalue

https://politicology.com/

In the 2nd part of our conversation with Jonathan Rauch, we do a deeper dive into his timely, ground breaking book THE CONSTITUTION OF KNOWLEDGE: A DEFENSE OF TRUTH. We discuss its goals of peace, freedom and knowledge; why authoritarians hate the Constitution of Knowledge; how to diagnose and resist the ills of disinformation and cancel culture; the effects of cancel culture such as "the spiral of silence"; how, at its center, the MAGA movement is all about disinformation; and how to transform the world by planting the seeds of big ideas.

JONATHAN RAUCH, a senior fellow at the Brookings Institution, is the author of eight books and many articles on public policy, culture, and government. He is a contributing writer for The Atlantic and recipient of the 2005 National Magazine Award, the magazine industry’s equivalent of the Pulitzer Prize. His latest book, The Constitution of Knowledge: A Defense of Truth is a deep-diving account of how to push back against disinformation, canceling, and other new threats to our fact-based epistemic order. His writing has also appeared in many other publications including The Economist, Time, The New York Times, The New York Daily News, The Wall Street Journal, The Washington Post, The Los Angeles Times, The New York Post, Slate, and others. Jonathan graduated from Yale University. He is the recipient of numerous national and international awards for his writing and has appeared as a guest on many television and radio programs. But perhaps most remarkably, he does not like shrimp!

www.jonathanrauch.com/about.html

www.theatlantic.com/author/jonathan-rauch/

www.brookings.edu/experts/jonathan-rauch/

https://www.brookings.edu/book/the-constitution-of-knowledge/

Grateful to be able to talk about politics and religion without killin' each other!

www.politicsandreligion.us

twitter.com/TPandRPod

www.facebook.com/TPandRPod

www.instagram.com/tpandrpod/

www.linkedin.com/company/tpandrpod

www.tiktok.com/@tpandrpod

...and our host

twitter.com/coreysnathan

www.facebook.com/coreysnathan

www.instagram.com/coreysnathan/

www.linkedin.com/in/coreysnathan/

This is part 1 of our conversation with Jonathan Rauch. We had to have Jon back for a follow up because, as you'll hear, he's such a genuine, inquisitive fellow, he ended up asking Corey more questions than the other way around. We touch upon a number of big ideas like the existence of God; how the gospel of Jesus contrasts with the way a lot of self-professed Christians act; the trauma gay Americans have had to endure from Christians; Jon also talks about amazing Christians he's gotten to know and the concept of grace; and how we can make religion less stupid. 

JONATHAN RAUCH, a senior fellow at the Brookings Institution, is the author of eight books and many articles on public policy, culture, and government. He is a contributing writer for The Atlantic and recipient of the 2005 National Magazine Award, the magazine industry’s equivalent of the Pulitzer Prize. His latest book, The Constitution of Knowledge: A Defense of Truth is a deep-diving account of how to push back against disinformation, canceling, and other new threats to our fact-based epistemic order. His writing has also appeared in many other publications including The Economist, Time, The New York Times, The New York Daily News, The Wall Street Journal, The Washington Post, The Los Angeles Times, The New York Post, Slate, and others. Jonathan graduated from Yale University. He is the recipient of numerous national and international awards for his writing and has appeared as a guest on many television and radio programs. But perhaps most remarkably, he does not like shrimp!

www.jonathanrauch.com/about.html

www.theatlantic.com/author/jonathan-rauch/

www.brookings.edu/experts/jonathan-rauch/

www.amazon.com/Constitution-Knowledge-Jonathan-Rauch/dp/0815738862/ref=tmm_hrd_swatch_0 

In this conversation with Sadhvi Bhagawati Saraswati, we discuss the "equation" we've been given to be happy and how unhappy that's left many of us; how she experienced a radical and seemingly impossible forgiveness; when religion gets it right; some of the core tenets of being Hindu; the power of a name; and the "groundwork and grand work" that Sadhviji is a part of among a number of other meaningful topics.

Sadhvi Bhagawati Saraswati, PhD is a renowned spiritual leader in India. She is President of Divine Shakti Foundation, a charitable organization bringing education and empowerment to women and children.  She is Secretary-General of Global Interfaith WASH Alliance, launched by UNICEF, the first alliance of religious leaders for Water, Sanitation and Hygiene. Sadhviji is also Director of the world-famous International Yoga Festival. Originally from Los Angeles, and a graduate of Stanford University, Sadhviji has lived at Parmarth Niketan, Rishikesh in the Himalayas for 25 years, where she gives spiritual discourses, satsang and meditation, and leads myriad humanitarian programs.

https://sadhviji.org/

www.facebook.com/SadhviBhagawatiSaraswati/

www.instagram.com/sadhviji/

www.youtube.com/channel/UCYY3tI53Jy5MUABaYGuSoEQ

Today we're joined by Liz Joyner and Vanessa Rowse of the Village Square. Liz is the Founder and CEO and Vanessa is the Podcast Producer of their great podcast Village SquareCast.

We get into all kinds of important, timely topics including 

• how we're all living in this "high energy environment";
• the "us vs. them dynamic" and what the solution is;
• the value of actually getting together in person;
• how the Village Square is able to get people of diverse views in the same venue together;
• how the first casualty in this environment is nuance;
• and being played by the "conflict entrepreneurs";
• in addition to a lot more ground we cover.

The Village Square is a nonprofit organization devoted to building vibrant civil dialogue across partisan and ideological divides on matters of local, state, and national importance in communities across America. Founded in Tallahassee, Florida in 2006 after a contentious debate on a local issue, the Village Square builds social civic community in a 21st century revival of the old-fashioned American town hall. The Village Square offers a menu of cutting-edge civic engagement programs, many in partnership with local government.

https://tlh.villagesquare.us/

https://pod.link/1520059234

Why are more and more young people leaving religion? Is religion the only way we can define our values? From what sources do nonreligious folks derive shared morals? We explore all these questions and much more, such as how the Secular Student Alliance is providing a point of connection for nonreligious students all over the country. We discuss secular and humanistic values, how SSA has been received on campuses, and of course we get into plenty of politics.

Kevin Bolling is the Executive Director of the Secular Student Alliance, an educational nonprofit and the only national organization dedicated to atheist, humanist, and other non-theist students. Kevin has served as the executive director of SSA since 2017 and has over 20 years of nonprofit leadership experience. His career has included over 10 years of student association management and on-campus program development from Los Angeles to Boston as well as serving in leadership positions with the California Thoroughbred Horsemen’s Foundation and the Gay Men's Chorus of Los Angeles.

https://secularstudents.org/

Brian Kaylor is the President and Editor-in-Chief of Word and Way (a Christian media company founded in 1896), he’s Associate Director of Churchnet and the host of an excellent podcast called Dangerous Dogma. Brian is also a prolific author, most recently of the books For God’s Sake, Shut Up!: Lessons for Christians on How to Speak Effectively and When to Remain Silent and Vote Your Principles: Party Must Not Trump Principles. Brian has a Ph.D. in Communication from the University of Missouri, and serves the Baptist World Alliance as chair of the Communication Advisory Committee and chair of the Resolutions Committee. He is a board member for the Baptist Peace Fellowship of North America and for the St. Louis Chapter of Americans United for Separation of Church and State. Brian has also taught college courses in advocacy studies, political communication, research methods, and public speaking.

Brian and Corey discuss a number of pertinent issues including how pastors are having to conform with their parishioners politics; a daunting comparison - that would be surprising to some - between the faith of Barack Obama and that of Donald Trump; the nature of faith and the opposite of faith; and we also discuss the separation of church and state among a number of other topics.

http://briankaylor.com/about/

https://wordandway.org/

https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/dangerous-dogma/id1570193355

"There's a gap between the realistic possible and the actual...and what can we do about it?" That's a premise we explore with our renowned guest, Dr. Rick Hanson, across numerous domains from the very personal to the political. Along with special co-host Savannah Nathan, we discuss the scientific observations of the benefits of meditation; Buddhism as a psychology and not necessarily a religion; and the nature of the mind and how it works. We also get into plenty of politics from unique traits humans developed over millions of years to many of the problems that ail us today to a simple yet ambitious vision Rick has articulated in the 2100 Project.

Rick Hanson, Ph.D., is a psychologist, Senior Fellow of the Greater Good Science Center at UC Berkeley, and is a New York Times best-selling author of such impactful books including NeuroDharma, Resilient, Hardwiring Happiness, Buddha’s Brain, Just One Thing, and Mother Nurture. He’s lectured at NASA, Google, Oxford, and Harvard, and taught in meditation centers worldwide. An expert on positive neuroplasticity, his work has been featured on the BBC, CBS, NPR, on his podcast that he co-hosts with his son Forrest Hanson Being Well and other major media. He began meditating in 1974 and is the founder of the Wellspring Institute for Neuroscience and Contemplative Wisdom.

Here are some helpful links:

www.rickhanson.net

www.rickhanson.net/being-well-podcast/

www.rickhanson.net/books/neurodharma/#order

www.wisebrain.org/wellspring-institute

www.tandfonline.com/doi/full/10.1080/17439760.2021.2006759

https://www.positiveneuroplasticity.com/

Kaitlyn Schiess is a writer and author who’s studying for her doctorate in political theology, ethics and biblical interpretation at Duke Divinity School and has earned her ThM in systematic theology from Dallas Theological Seminary. In 2020, Kaitlyn’s book The Liturgy of Politics: Spiritual Formation for the Sake of Our Neighbor created quite a stir. She has also written about theology, politics, and culture in outlets such as Christianity Today, The New York Times, Sojourners, several other national publications and is rather prolific on Twitter!

We cover a lot of ground in this conversation. Part of Kaitlyn's journey that is unique is that not a lot of people start out at Liberty Univ. for undergrad and then end up at Duke Divinity for their doctoral work. It was interesting to hear Kaitlyn's thoughts about where many of her Liberty classmates stand in terms of politics and theology today. We also talked about "What story am I buying into?" and how our paradigms affect how we interpret what's happening in the world. We went on to assess some of the problems that ail our culture in the church and more broadly, and we explore prescriptions of how we might be able to move forward.

https://kaitlynschiess.com/

https://twitter.com/KaitlynSchiess

https://www.instagram.com/kaitlynschiess/

https://www.indiebound.org/book/9780830848300